Tai Zen: What’s up guys. This is Tai Zen. With me today, I have the honorable grandmaster LeonFu.com. By the way, he made some good calls in that Stratis.
Leon Fu: Oh yeah
Tai Zen: Really good. Made some good calls on Stratis and Decree.
Leon Fu: Decred? That was a big winner.
Tai Zen: That was a big winner for the team. There’s a couple of last-minute ones that you made a good call too.
Anyways, in this video, we will give some thoughts about an issue. Normally, we don’t waste time with stuff like this. However, in this particular case, we have to discuss it because it’s a security concern.
Leon Fu: Well, it is an investment concern too.
Tai Zen: It’s also an investment concern, but we also want to make sure that you do the right thing when this fork can happen.
Just a quick summary here. Based on what we know about this whole mess, Bitcoin Core is the Bitcoin software that is being put out by a company called Blockstream. All most of the top software engineers working for Blockstream to create the software.
There are like 5,000, 6,000 Bitcoin nodes out there that process Bitcoin transactions and the majority of them are using the Bitcoin Core software that is created by them.
Now they have a competitor called a Bitcoin Unlimited being created by a guy named Roger Ver.
Leon Fu: I don’t know if he is the creator or not, but he the biggest promoter.
Tai Zen: He’s the biggest promoter for the Bitcoin Unlimited software.
Therefore, there’s a heavyweight battle right now between Bitcoin Core software and Bitcoin Unlimited software.
If you go to a website called coin.dance and click on the icon that says Blocks, it will show you which one of this software is finding more blocks.
You know that every 10 minutes, the Bitcoin network spits out the new block. The first person to finds that new block gets a reward of 12.5 Bitcoins. Each block is worth about $12,500.
If you add the mining fees on top of that. I think I’ve seen blocks that are worth a little bit over $14,000 according to blockchain.info. That’s the current landscape right now.
Just remember guys. In trading and investing, whenever there is a certainty in the market, the price will either go up or go down. The worst thing that you can have in the markets is the uncertainty where the market doesn’t know what’s going on and where it’s going to go up or down.
Because of this uncertainty, there’s a lot of people that’s dumping their Bitcoins and getting rid of them. There’s a famous Bitcoin investor like Vinny Lingham
Leon Fu: Founder of Gyft
Tai Zen: He’s out in California. Supposedly on the Bitcoin meisters show, he proclaimed that he dumped 90% of his Bitcoins.
I just want everyone to know no one on our team that has to dump any Bitcoins. When we say dumping the Bitcoin, that means we’re converting the Bitcoins back into a Fiat currency such as USD, EUR or YEN. I don’t know anybody on our team doing that. We still believe in Bitcoins.
We are kind of like in the closet Bitcoin maximalists. Most people don’t realize that. We just invest in cryptocurrencies and the altcoins because it allows us to accumulate more Bitcoins. However, that’s the one that we mainly have our eyes set on.
That’s just a quick overview of Bitcoin Core versus Bitcoin Unlimited.
Let’s just talk quickly, so the audience knows what the objective of each of this software is from your perspective, then from my perspective. After that, we’ll talk about what we think is safe for the investors to do if you’re a Bitcoin holder.
Based on your understanding, what is the difference between Bitcoin Core and Bitcoin Unlimited and why are they at odds against each other? First of all, talking about what they are.
Leon Fu: The problem arose because back in the day, Satoshi Nakamoto put this 1 MB hard limit on the block size. He did this very, very early on. From his writings, it is said that this was supposed to be a temporary thing that he put on just to make it easier to debug the code and that limit is still with us today.
However, the difference is the transaction volume has grown to such a point that nearly all the blocks are full. If you use Bitcoins, first of all, it cost 50 cents to $1 to send your Bitcoins. This means that’s extremely expensive compared to when Bitcoin first came out, which was nearly free.
Tai Zen: When you and I have sent our first Bitcoin transactions in 2013, most of them were free.
Leon Fu: You only had to put a fee if you sent your Bitcoins too frequently. If you waited 1 or 2 weeks and sent the Bitcoins, you didn’t even have to put a fee. It was like zero fees.
I still remember many of my transactions had no fees at all. That’s no longer the case today. Today I am paying 80 cents for my last Bitcoin transaction.
Tai Zen: I’ve paid as high as $1.50
Leon Fu: That’s very expensive for an electronic payment method. Even Paypal doesn’t charge us that much. That’s the problem.
Besides the 2 different sets of developers, they’re also using 2 very different sets of technologies.
Let’s talk about Bitcoin Core. They’re pushing something called segregated witness (SegWit).
Because we are investing channel, I don’t want to get into how segwit works, but I think what we need to know as investors is a segregated witness is known as a soft fork.
It means whatever Bitcoin software you’re using, you don’t have to upgrade it. Your Bitcoin software should continue to work as it does. That’s what a soft fork is. That’s the method that Bitcoin Core wants to pursue.
For Bitcoin Unlimited, they want no block size limit. That’s why the name is Bitcoin Unlimited. It will be up to the miners to decide how big or small the blocks will be. The reason is there is one line in the code base saying reject this if the block is more than 1 MB.
Therefore, they want to remove that and just allow any block to go through that the miner wants to do. Unfortunately, that is known as a hard fork, meaning that…
Tai Zen: …in order to implement that feature…
Leon Fu: you must upgrade. You have to create a fork. If any of the Bitcoin community who chooses not to upgrade, which means they do not actually take an active step and download new software, they will no longer see these blocks from Bitcoin Unlimited. That’s the 2 camps.
Tai Zen: Let me rephrase it to see if I understand it correctly. Let’s just say you went on vacation and you never had any electronic access or Internet access.
Leon Fu: or you forgot about your Bitcoin.
Tai Zen: or you’re in a hospital in a coma or something like that. One day you come back and you open up your Bitcoin wallet, Bitcoin Core wants to make sure that you can still open up your Bitcoin wallet software and still send and receive Bitcoins.
Leon Fu: That’s right.
Tai Zen: The rest of the networks still recognize that your Bitcoins and your transactions. They are legitimate.
Leon Fu: That’s right.
Tai Zen: With Bitcoin Unlimited, if you were away from the Internet for a while and you opened up your Bitcoin Unlimited software, your Bitcoins would still be there,…
Leon Fu: …but your software and your wallet will not be seeing the same blocks as the Bitcoin Unlimited nodes. Anyone running Bitcoin Unlimited has a different view of reality from your view of reality.
Tai Zen: So the goal of Bitcoin Core is to make sure that the software that’s being used today is can be used even if they don’t upgrade it.
Leon Fu: They still see the same transactions.
Tai Zen: Everybody’s in consensus and agreement.
Leon Fu: That’s right. That’s their objective. That’s what segregated witness is trying to do
Tai Zen: Basically, Bitcoin Core is trying to update the software without having to force everyone to update the software.
Leon Fu: That’s correct.
Tai Zen: Whereas, on Bitcoin Unlimited, everyone has to update their software. If they don’t update it, they’re not going to be in agreement with everyone else.
Leon Fu: That’s correct. Those are the 2 sides right now.
Tai Zen: I want to add this piece too. Now, the audience knows what the difference between Bitcoin Core and Bitcoin Unlimited is. Based on my limited research and understanding about Bitcoin Core and Bitcoin Unlimited, Bitcoin Core is designed to be a platform, meaning that they are going to have a platform where other engineers can come and build features on top of it.
Whereas, Bitcoin Unlimited led by Roger Ver wants to make Bitcoin as a currency, because when Satoshi wrote the original white paper, he said Bitcoin was a supposed to be peer-to-peer electronic cash system.
In case you don’t know who Roger Ver is, supposedly he has like 300,000 Bitcoins. He’s one of the wealthy Bitcoin investors out there because he was one of the early adopters of Bitcoin. He believes that all these new people coming into Bitcoin is trying to change it up. Therefore, he wants to keep it the same as it was supposed to be by Satoshi Nakamoto.
Leon Fu: Or his perception.
Tai Zen: We’re not saying that he’s right or wrong. We’re just saying that’s what he states out there.
Overall, Bitcoin Core is more focused on being a platform that everybody can build stuff on top
Leon Fu: A sort of value. I think is what is commonly said.
Tai Zen: Bitcoin Unlimited wants it to be more of an electronic cash system with the cheapest transaction costs as possible.
I don’t know if it’s factual, but basically, those are the facts laid out for the difference between Bitcoin Core versus Bitcoin Unlimited.
Now let’s talk about what could happen if the Bitcoin Unlimited software starts to produce more blocks than the Bitcoin Core that’s currently used right now by everyone.
Leon Fu: Let’s say there’s a split in the network, where there’s a group of miners or group of users decide to follow the Bitcoin Core chain. They will diverge from the Bitcoin Unlimited crowd.
Tai Zen: Let’s call the Bitcoin Unlimited the new chain and the Bitcoin Core is the old chain.
Leon Fu: Right now, they’re all on the same railroad tracks right. If they fork, these railroad tracks are going to split.
Tai Zen: What’s the danger in that.
Leon Fu: Now, the danger is similar to what happened to Ethereum. We will have 2 versions of what’s called Bitcoin.
Tai Zen: All the exchanges have agreed that in the case this happens, they will list the older chain under the symbol BTC or XBT, which is the international symbol. For the new Bitcoin Unlimited, all the exchanges have agreed to list it as an altcoin and it’s going to be called BTU, which stands for Bitcoin Unlimited. They’re going to have the international symbol as XBU.
If that happens, let’s just say for example you have 10 Bitcoins on the original…
Leon Fu: Let’s sit back. We don’t know if it’s going to happen.
Tai Zen: We don’t know if it’s going to happen, but the viewers need to understand if it does happen, what they can expect based on the experience we went through with the Ethereum hard fork.
In case that happens, you’re going to end up having whatever number of Bitcoins that you have on the original Bitcoin chain. Besides, you also have a duplicate amount on the new chain.
If you have 10 Bitcoins right now, it will become 10 Bitcoin Core and 10 Bitcoin Unlimited. The exchanges have already agreed to list both of them. I think the only one that has not agreed was Coinbase last time I checked
Leon Fu: Yes. On Poloniex, I read the statement is if you are holding Bitcoin deposits on Poloniex, they will credit your account with that equal number of Bitcoin Unlimited.
Tai Zen: Let’s talk about the exchanges, the wallets and everything we’ve known so far. Let’s just start with the hardware wallet because that’s where you should be keeping them anyway.
When I reached out to the manufacturer of the Ledger Nano S, they suggested that you just keep the coins inside the Ledger Nano S until the company updates the software and they will allow you to split between Bitcoin Core and Bitcoin Unlimited, so they don’t get mixed up.
They are working on it right now and they’re prepared for that to update the ledger software in case that does happen.
You do not need to panic if you owned the Ledger Nano S because the company is going to create a software that’s going to help you separate those 2 Bitcoins.
If you’re not familiar with it, it’s very similar to how the Ethereum software’s being used right now, because the ethereal software has the Ethereum hard fork and the Ethereum Classic. You just select which one you want and then they’ll give it to you.
I know the Ledger Nano S they said that they’re going to create the software for the users to separate the coins. If they’re doing that, I’m almost certain that the other hardware wallets will do the same thing too.
LeonFu: Most wallets, I believe, will. I read some tweets from Breadwallet, one of my favorites, and they say they don’t intend to, but I don’t really believe them. I think if both chains are surviving, no one will use their wallet anymore.
Tai Zen: I believe that their wallet is good and they have such popularity that I don’t think they’re going to risk.
Leon Fu: For the users, if your wallet allows you to export your private keys, then you should be fine because you can load those private keys into any wallet that will support them. Even if that wallet manufacturer chooses not to support it, you can take those private keys and import it into one that will.
For example, Exodus allows you to export your private keys and many other wallets do as well. That’s really what the key feature of that wallet. If you’re in a wallet that allows you to export private keys, I think you should be okay.
Tai Zen: I know Exodus does that
Leon Fu: Because I’ve done it before.
Tai Zen: I’ve done it before too.
Leon Fu: I think that’s the technical side about that.
Tai Zen: Let’s take a look at the different options that are available to the investors. What they can do.
If you don’t want to deal with all this controversy, there are a few things that you guys can do. We’re just going to list out the different options that you have as an investor, but it does not mean that this is what we recommend.
If you have a small number of Bitcoins, let’s say that is 1, 2 or 3 months worth of living expenses, it may not make a big difference if you just keep Bitcoins.
Leon Fu: This will blow over.
Tai Zen: For example, if I have $5,000 in Bitcoins,…
Leon Fu: That’s 5 Bitcoins.
Tai Zen: ….in America, that would not be considered a lot because that’s only a month worth of living expenses.
Therefore, if you have less than 6 months worth of living expenses, you might just want to just keep it in your positions, in Bitcoin or whatever altcoin that you have.
However, if have over a year’s worth of living expenses, you really need to pay attention. What I’m going to do is put all my Bitcoins in Ledger Nano S hardware wallet and keep it there. I’m not going to do anything with it. I’m going to wait until this fork or no fork dies over, then I’m going to let them…
Leon Fu: well, it’s hard to know.
Tai Zen: Nobody knows what’s going to happen.
Leon Fu: I think right now is just to make sure you have access to your private keys. That’s all you can do.
Even if it does a fork, there’s no way to absolutely know for sure whether or not there’s going to be 2 versions of Bitcoin. If it does, we also don’t know whether which chain wins over the other. Let’s say if Bitcoin Unlimited decides to go hard fork and activate their big blocks, there’s no way to know.
Here’s my take on this. Right now, I think there’s too much credit believe that it’s the miners who are going to decide
Tai Zen: It’s not the miners.
Leon Fu: Everybody’s looking at the hash rate, block signatures, and the pool, but I don’t believe that. The miners are important, but I think the community has more influence than they do.
Tai Zen: Let’s look at different scenarios here. If Bitcoin Unlimited forks and there are 2 coins now, the miners can choose whichever one that they want to mine or whichever software they want to use Bitcoin Core or Bitcoin Unlimited. However, the users like you and I,…
Leon Fu: Let’s say none of us upgrade our software and Bitcoin Unlimited forks. Our software would just reject all their blocks, so we don’t see our Bitcoin Unlimited because we’re not using them.
For example, when we thought Ether Classic was dead,…
Tai Zen: We even put tweets out there that it’s a scam.
Leon Fu: …but Poloniex decided to list it and all the users and investors decided to trade it. Then it came back to life, so we have to change our perspective. That leads to my conclusion where I think the users have a huge influence.
We might have two chains, but if the majority of the users don’t upgrade their software and don’t recognize the other chain, it really doesn’t matter how much hash and power there is or what the mining pool is.
I’m going back to what Charles Hoskinson said, which is the value of what is real is determined by the community. Miners have one say in that because they’re responsible for the hashing power, which is responsible for the security, but it’s not the everything.
Tai Zen: In case you don’t know who Charles Hoskinson is, He’s the former co-founder of the Ethereum, not the CEO of Ethereum. He’s the CEO of a company called IOHK Input Output Hong Kong. He said that cryptocurrencies and success is based on the community.
There are several scenarios that you can imagine. One is that the Bitcoin is going to split into Bitcoin Core and Bitcoin Unlimited. Therefore, I hold both of them. If I don’t believe in Bitcoin Unlimited tokens, I can just go to the exchange, dump and convert them all to Bitcoin Core
Leon Fu: You’re making a trading decision,…
Tai Zen: …which means I am going to support Bitcoin Core.
Leon Fu: On the other hand, there are many buyers making the opposite decision.
Tai Zen: They might be selling Bitcoin Core in exchange for Bitcoin Unlimited.
Leon Fu: If you’re selling it, he’s buying it. Therefore, it’s really hard to say what the community is going to do.
Tai Zen: Because this is the first time that this has happened.
Leon Fu: it’s happened with Ethereum
Tai Zen: Yeah. However, here is the thing. With Ethereum, it was an accident, whereas with Bitcoin it is expected.
Let’s talk about some action steps here so that the viewer can understand what to do.
Leon Fu: Let’s talk about like what the choices are regardless of how many Bitcoins you have.
The first choice if you do nothing. You just make sure your Bitcoins are secure. Make sure you keep it in a hardware wallet and you’re able to get access to those private keys.
The second choice if you sell your Bitcoins into Fiat
Tai Zen: Into USD, EUR or YEN
Leon Fu: You may think there is a lot of uncertainty and volatility ahead.
Tai Zen: There’s going to be massive volatility
Leon Fu: We’re sitting here at $900 and $950. We don’t know what’s going to happen, but we believe that if the community comes together and no fork happens, we’re going to have huge volatility.
Tai Zen: Up to $2,000, $3,000
Leon Fu: I will also say the altcoins were in are going to get slaughtered.
Tai Zen: Before talking about what’s going to happen, let’s go back and focus on choices. Number 1 is that you do nothing. Number 2 is you go into Fiat and you sit it out to wait for a resolution
Tai Zen: Let’s look at the advantage and disadvantage of each of those choices. If you do nothing, what’s the advantage and disadvantage of that?
Leon Fu: The benefit is if the community somehow finds a way to come together, you’re going to be a huge winner from here to the upside. It will go on a rocket ship up back to $1200 and beyond. I think we can literally run to $2000. This is possible.
Tai Zen: And what’s the risk.
Leon Fu: The risk is when the fork happens, you end up with 2 kinds of Bitcoins. I believe that the combined value of these 2 coins will be less than what we have today. That’s my view.
Tai Zen: You’re saying that right now Bitcoin’s at $950 and the combined value of Bitcoin Core and Bitcoin Unlimited will be less than $950. Plus, there’s going to be a slow period before Bitcoin goes back up again
Leon Fu: or if the community fractures because a lot of this has to do with the network effect.
Once you’ve fractured the community, you’ve lost your network effect. That’s going to give an opening for Ethereum. I believe that the Bitcoin dominance index will continue to fall. Furthermore, how do we even calculate the Bitcoin dominance index? Do we combine these 2? Which is the real Bitcoin? How would you even compute that?
Tai Zen: That’s the first choice’s risk and reward. In the second choice, we convert it to Fiat currencies, so what is the risk the reward?
Leon Fu: The risk is if you sell all your Bitcoins and go to cash, if this gets resolved, you’re going to miss out. On the other hand if the community fractures, it is a very good likelihood that not only Bitcoin goes down, but a lot of the altcoins go down.
Tai Zen: So it’s going to destroy everything.
Leon Fu: It’s really hard to say right now. It could take everything down. It could take the alts down or we might see a continuation with the alts such as Ethereum dominating and taking over it. That’s a possibility.
Tai Zen: Ethereum or Dash will try to sneak their ways in and take over the market.
Leon Fu: I know the maximalists among us say that’s not a possibility. We have our beloved Bitcoin maximalists, who think Bitcoin is our destiny. That’s kind of how I feel about them. They just think that no matter what happens, it’s always going to be Bitcoin.
I don’t believe that. I believe that it’s very much in the air as to who is the ultimate winner of cryptocurrencies.
You can just simply move to the sidelines and wait for the dust to settle. You’re going to miss out on that upside if there is a resolution. However, you could just jump back in.
I think we get to $2000 and if we don’t hard fork. Therefore, you could still probably get in 20%, 30% higher from there and then just ride it the rest.
Tai Zen: You talked about doing nothing or go into Fiat currency. The risk is that you miss out the upside gain if it’s resolved. The reward is you are protecting it against the downside.
Everyone agrees that it’s going to go crazy one way or the other. If it goes down, you’re protected. If it goes up, you miss out on it. What is the third choice?
Leon Fu: The third possibility is the view in which Bitcoin crashes and one of the other altcoins takes the lead. That looks very possible, especially for Ethereum right now. Ethereum is sitting here at $4 billion.
Remember that doubling is not happening all the time in crypto. If Bitcoin drops to, let’s say $500, and Ethereum is $50 right now, it can go to $100, which can happen overnight. Then, we could easily see Ethereum take over.
Tai Zen: If Ethereum takes over, I mean it can run up to $500.
Leon Fu: I don’t care what the maximalists say. Bitcoins future is not guaranteed.
Tai Zen: You have 3 choices: do nothing, go to a Fiat currency or stay in the alts.
Tai Zen: We say that because the altcoins are not having the volatility at the moment, but the downside risks of Bitcoin does.
Leon Fu: No. If Bitcoin collapses, I don’t think that that’s a good future in the short run for the altcoins either. I think that it damages the entire space.
The altcoins will do fine if there’s a gradual decline in Bitcoin over time. If there’s just a sudden collapse, I think to get crushed temporarily at least
Tai Zen: There is a fourth choice that you haven’t spoken about.
Leon Fu: And what is that?
Tai Zen: The fourth choice is if you have altcoins or cryptocurrencies, you can convert it into US Tether. Do you want to explain that?
Tai Zen: Poloniex also trades in these things called Tether coin.
Tai Zen: The symbol for it is USDT. Make sure that’s the correct symbol.
Leon Fu: Those coins are basically issued out of the bank in Hong Kong. They’re USD equivalent, which means they can be traded 1 for 1 to the USD. The reason is you can redeem them for USD with a fee. I think their fee is $20 bucks, 0.2% or more.
You can buy Tethers from them and they’ll issue you Tethers in return, or you can redeem the Tethers. They’re supposed to be actual USD in a Hong Kong bank account.
Tai Zen: This is probably almost the same as converting it to USD. The only difference is it’s stable and you don’t have to withdraw it out of the crypto accounts. You can leave your coins there at the Poloniex and be ready for trading. What are the risk and the reward for that?
Leon Fu: These tokens are backed by a company. If that company were to go under or if there was some kind of fraud, of course, there’s no more backing. The reason they have value is you can take those coins, go to this company and get USD back for them. That’s why they’re trading 1 for actual bank deposits.
Tai Zen: Obviously, you have to submit your personal info.
Leon Fu: You have to do all the KYC/AML
Tai Zen: Know your customer and anti-money laundering rules and everything.
Leon Fu: Only if you want to redeem them. If you just want to trade them, you don’t have to do that.
Tai Zen: you don’t have to reveal yourself.
That’s also an option to consider if you intend to put the money back in crypto, but you want to go to a cash equivalent in the short run.
I wouldn’t endorse it if you want to hold USD crypto over years Because I’m not sure about their reputation.
Leon Fu: However, they’ve been on Poloniex for a long time. They’ve held their value and they also have over $30 million in deposits, which is quite a bit of money.
Tai Zen: If you want to hold of money there for a week or a month, yes, but not for long-term storage.
Leon Fu: I wouldn’t quite recommend it because I personally don’t have the confidence and trust in them yet. However, for the trading position, I’m fine with that.
Tai Zen: Is there anything else you want to add to this whole scenario?
Leon Fu: No
Tai Zen: Overall, there are 4 options that you can to choose to do. One is to do nothing. Two is that you convert your Bitcoins and your altcoins into Fiat currencies. Three is you convert all your Bitcoins and put them in the altcoins. Four is you put it into USD Tether, so it stays right there and you can access once the dust settles.
Leon Fu: If you take it out into actual Fiat, that’s a 3-day window. There are also tax issues, but the main point is it’s going to be much harder to get back into the market.
If you liquidate your Bitcoins or altcoins into USD, it’s going to take 2 to 5 business days to move it to your bank account. Then, when you want to get back in, it’s going to take you 2 to 5 business days to get back in. This is a reason why you might want to leave it in USD Tethers.
Tai Zen: Hopefully this video helps you inform the decision on what to do with your Bitcoins and your altcoins during this mess that we’re going through. I wish that it would hurry up and get settled so that Bitcoin goes back. Then, we can get back to focusing on investing in the cryptocurrencies.
Hopefully, this video is able to help you understand better the difference between Bitcoin Core and Bitcoin Unlimited, as well as the choices that you have to protect your portfolio during these volatile times.
If you have any friends, family or relatives that are interested in learning how to invest in cryptocurrencies, make sure that you share our channel with them.
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We’re at Ponce City market in downtown Atlanta. We’re hungry and we’re going to conclude this video. Thanks for watching these guys.